Bonus Episode: An In-Depth Look at Practicum Education

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Description

What makes practicum education a cornerstone of social work training? 

In this episode, Melody York Zuniga, LMSW, Associate Dean for Academic Affairs & Clinical Professor, and Whitney Luce, LMSW, Director of Practicum Education & Clinical Associate Professor, at Baylor University’s Garland School of Social Work discuss how over 1,000 partner sites across the country provide students with invaluable hands-on experience, career-shaping internships, and personalized support. Melody shares insights from her research on supporting sexual assault survivors, while Whitney highlights how internships connect theory to practice, preparing students for leadership roles in social work. 

Join us and explore how practicum education transforms social work students into confident, compassionate professionals.

Transcript

SPEAKERS

Melody York Zuniga, Curtis Isozaki, Whitney Luce

Curtis Isozaki  00:00

Hello Everyone! Thank you so much for joining us at The Garland School of Social Work here at Baylor University. We're so excited for our webinar today titled "Understanding Practicum Education in the Diana R Garland School of Social Work," and we have two wonderful faculty members here with us to share a little bit about practicum education here [today]. I would love for both of them to introduce themselves; if you could share kind of, your name, your role, any research interests that you may have, and a favorite memory that you have in The Garland School of Social Work. 

Melody York Zuniga  00:34

Okay, I'll go first. I see Professor Luce tagging me here. I'm Melody York Zuniga. I'm a clinical associate professor here at The Garland School and the Associate Dean for Academic Affairs. I've been here since 2009, full-time, and did some part-time teaching for a couple years before that. So been around for a whole minute and super, super thankful to still be here.  My research interests are really focused on my practice experience was responding and supporting sexual assault survivors and other survivors of crime. So when I get a chance to be a part of a project involved in that area, that's really rewarding for me, and then also looking at crisis on a larger scale and organizational scale, what it looks like to have leadership that's supportive during those kinds of times. So those are the areas that when I find time to do research. I'm drawn to those kinds of topics.  A favorite memory for me thinking about being a teacher. So I teach often in the first level of practice skill courses, as well as the capstone class. That's a thing that students take in the very end of their time in the MSW program., and so I, my favorite kinds of memories - I have things pop up, but its these "Aha!" moments when students realize that they kind of know something and they can do something because they start off feeling so different than the beginning of the program.So I think about, you know, leading a groups class where people learn to lead groups, which can be really intimidating for some but then I have alums come back and say, "Guess what? I actually did this in my group I led, and I can't believe I used this tool or this strategy that we talked about in class, and I knew what I was doing." So those things are really rewarding, and then at the end in the capstone course, when students are reflecting on all the different things they've learned and what they really do add to the profession already upon graduation, those are some of my favorite parts of being a teacher here.

Whitney Luce  02:44

Well, I will jump in! I'm Whitney Luce. I am the Director of Practicum Education. I'm also a Clinical Associate Professor. I have been here at The Garland School since 2014, and am so grateful to be in my role. Practicum education is obviously a major interest for me in my administrative role. As I have been in this role longer, I've just really been interested in the importance of practicum education and the ways that we can shape students experiences and support them, and look at experiences differently through different intersectional lenses to really make sure that the policies and practicum education are supportive of all of our students. So that has really become an interest for me in this role.  In previous social work, practitioner roles, some of the things that have been of interest to me and continue to be as I teach are Medical Social Work, particularly with within the NICU setting, and working with parents. Both with infants transitioning to home, but also with bereavement work. I have really found a place in grief and bereavement work, through my work in the NICU and just walking alongside people who find themselves in situations where they never thought that they would be. Just the honor to be in those spaces, and then the power of healing that can come through people being in groups together, supporting one another, and just in small ways, offering empowerment and really companionship with people in small ways, supporting them. I am able to teach about trauma loss and mourning now, which really calls on that experience.  A recent memory that has been really impactful is just seeing end of year projects in the class "Trauma, Loss, and Mourrning," and seeing ways that students have taken their own grief experiences or content about grief, and created art or music or even curriculums to use with groups that really show their grasp of the concept, and also the ways that they're bringing their own experience, their own strengths, to that and creating something new and innovative. I'm just blown away with the way that students can really use professional use of self, which is something we talk about in Social Work is. You know, Social Work is -we need to know the research, we need to learn specific techniques, but then we also need to maintain that human connection. So seeing them use their own humanity and bring that together with the content is always just incredible, and something that I really enjoy being a part of.  Another thing that I always remember, those moments in practicum classes where students are sharing about their internships, and when the rest of the class comes together and says, "Wow, you did that with that client. You did that in an agency. And let's all just take a moment and say, good job, because that was really hard, and thank you for sharing that with us." So those are the moments as a teacher that I sit back and go, "Wow, look at what students are doing and the way that they're really celebrating each other," is really just impactful for me, [and] is really a joy to be part of.

Curtis Isozaki  06:41

Such rich introductions, Professor Zuniga, Professor Luce. Thank you so much for sharing just about your research interests and some of your areas of focus and passion that you also bring to the classroom, as well as your just deep care for students. Love hearing those, those "wow" moments that happen in your classroom. I just want to jump in as well and imagine there are students joining in on this call that would also love to kind of be a part of that kind of experience. As so many of you know, our mission in The Garland School of Social Work is to prepare Social Workers for service and leadership worldwide, and a part of social work education is practicum education. So I would love, Professor Zuniga, if you can share, how does practicum education at Baylor University differ from other programs, and how does it prepare students for real world Social Work?

Melody York Zuniga  07:36

Yeah, that's a great question, because any Master of Social Work program a student joins is going to have an internship, practicum requirement. So we're not unique in that way, but I'm really proud of the way we approach practicum education, because I do think that is a difference that students will find in other schools. With Baylor, it's a very hands on process. Students are not just kind of thrown out to say, "hey, you need to start an internship by September, so good luck. Here's the requirements. Godspeed is you find a place," snd there's actually some schools where that is the approach. You're given a list of expectations. [Other schools say] "make sure you find a place that'll do this and it's due at this time," and that really leaves students kind of at a disadvantage, I think, in securing something that actually can come together and have all the pieces that are needed in time.  With Baylor, it's a very collaborative, hands on process, so students do get to have input, but they're not the ones responsible for finding it. We have a whole team of people with different roles in identifying places across the country. I know Professor Luce can verify how many sites, but it's over 1000 sites that we are partnered with across the country. In last summer, it was 48 states. That's maybe changed, but we're very well connected across the country. [We are] always building new sites, because our goal is to get every student a place as close to their hometown as possible that has rich, meaningful social work experiences, and a social worker to supervise them and doing those things. So students get a chance to give input about interests and needs and requests or things like that.  Then they're partnered with someone on our practicum team to look at how does that fit into available spots that they've identified, that do you have actual social work experience you're going to do. You're not just going to be the person making copies or getting coffee, although you might do that, because maybe you're an agency where everybody does that to help each other out, but you're also going to be seeing clients, and you're going to be overseeing some kind of project that is building the competence you need to graduate and be ready for Social Work.  We're going to ensure that there's an educational experience. We're going to follow along as the students are part of that. There's some schools where they, the internship, is a piece of what you have to do, but you just kind of maybe check in with one person here and there, and then you complete your requirements. At Baylor so proud that we've been able to carve out space in our curriculum to have an actual course, a two hour seminar every week, that you get course credit for. Every semester that you're in an internship, you're also in this internship course. So you not only, Professor Luce mentioned other students in your seminar class, so you're not only partnered with a social worker overseeing your internship, but you have a teacher that follows you along during that experience. That's a Baylor faculty member, employee, and you have a class of students that you see each week where you're processing, "Man, this was really difficult, or I felt really unsure of what to do." Or, like Professor Lewis mentioned, "I can't believe I actually took this," and it went well. Or, or look at how the client is finding success in their situation, and I got to be a part of that, or you're hearing other students talk about what they did, and you think "I haven't had to do that yet. Now I have heard another experience of what that can look like." And you're also exposed to multiple sites, right? So you get one internship for two terms at the first level of the MSW program, and then the advanced level, you get another internship for two terms. For most students, that's two sites and the MSW program, but you're in a class with, you know, 810, 12 other people hearing about their sites and their other kinds of agencies. I myself fell for the kind of victim and survivor advocacy work because I was sitting in a class in my MSW program at a different kind of site for my internship, and hearing people talk about what they were doing. I was really drawn to the experiences my classmate was sharing about the kind of moments she was able to enter into with clients at this organization that served crime survivors, and was just like, I want to try that. I want to be a part of that. So you really get a lot of processing support about the what it's like through the experiences, whereas, as well as hearing other skills and other kinds of agencies that might be something you didn't realize you were interested in. So it's really a chance to have a lot of support in getting settled and someone making sure you're getting your needs met along the way, and having a team of a support system in the fellow classmates along the way. So I think that's really rich, and we've worked hard to protect that in our curriculum, because there's so many classes we want to offer and so many things, but our school has really supported that this seminar dedicated to supporting students and guiding and monitoring through the internship experience is vital.  You also asked about how it prepares students for real world social work. Um, you know, there's a lot of kind of first time learning and not [just] first time. Some of you that are considering a master's program may already be in Social Work-like roles, or maybe you're a bachelor level social worker already, but there's a lot of in the internship kind of, "oh, so this is what it looks like to actually do it." That can can be both daunting [and] eye opening, but also really like, "okay, now I get it," and you - as real clients, we're not just simulating. What would you do if you met with this person in this video? There may be some of that in preparing you right in classes, or in gearing up to get started for orientation, but then you are really walking into a room with someone who has experienced life in a hard way, and you are serving a Social Work role with them. That's incredible experience you have on your resume when you end and you aren't as shocked when you get into what human systems really look like, what organizational, organizational work really looks like. That's not a surprise to you, and you make connections along the way. You every day that you go into internship, you're building connections that will serve you as you enter the profession. And I think that's really important about thinking about that as you enter into social work. So many of the things I was able to do is because I met that person along the way in an internship and we were on a project together, or on a task force together. So those are some of the ways where I think it prepares you to walk in with experience be seen as someone who knows what they're doing already and able to move into leadership positions more quickly.

Curtis Isozaki  14:59

Professor Zuniga, Thank you so much for just sharing a lot about your experience, but also just how robust or practical education really is at an R1 institution, like the Diana R. Garland School of Social Work. I think what I'm thinking about is what we like to call at Baylor University, "the Baylor difference," but what I'm really feeling is how Social Workers are making a difference in a variety of different spaces. Really, just locally, but like you said, like practicum sites all over our nation, which is fantastic!  And Professor Luce, you have been the director of director of practicum education over the last few years, and you have been to practicum sites where we have alumni running those locations, you've been in conversations with those but you've also have sent several students to these various field education places, placements, and so we'll love to hear from you. If you can share a story or example of a student's practical experience that had a profound impact on their career. So if you can share an example of a student's practical experience that had a profound impact on their career.

Whitney Luce  16:09

So, of course, I first just want to say that I echo a lot of what Professor Zuniga said about the ways that internships can shape our students careers. So whether that be, I [the student] have found my internship is the area where I want to continue in this or through my internship seminar, I have learned about another possibility, and through that vicarious learning, I've learned about that. That is very impactful. I always tell students whether you learn what you definitely want to do or what you don't want to do, or aspects of that like I really liked, I resonated with this part, but not this part. All of that really helps to shape your future career choices. And another part of that that also shapes your career is the day to day. How do I walk alongside people, hear hard stories and still go back and be refreshed and fully present? So some of that self-care aspect is so important, and I just thought about that as Professor Zuniga was speaking.  So I do think many of our students are not, I think, I know, that many of our students do end up getting hired at their internship sites or through networking in their internship they then are hired through.Organizations that they worked closely with or that they learned about through their internship, and then their supervisor knew someone who was hiring. So the connections made certainly have a profound impact on their long term career.  One student that I think about I actually was serving as a practicum liaison at the time, so I was teaching one of the internship seminars for. A student who told me herself [that they] had a very privileged upbringing, and came from a family who had some really strong beliefs about certain things that she had no experience with. As she got into internship, she began to hear stories that she had never heard before, and to interact with with clients in a way that really started to change her ideas, really started to broaden her perspective. She really was wrestling with some things and saying, "Wow, I thought I knew what I thought about this, but through these experiences and hearing new stories and through doing research. I feel like I I'm really having a new perspective, not only on social work, but on people's lives and what they're experiencing." So she ended up doing a project and for her Capstone, presenting about her work with teenagers who identified as transgender. She really felt called to do some advocacy work for families and for teenagers based on her experiences. She also shared with me, personally some of the conversations that she was having in her family to say, "let's be open minded, let's be curious as we interact with people who have walked a different path than we have personally." For her, she just really came away from that one, impacted with career goals, but also impacted personally with this outlook of approaching new experiences with grace, curiosity, um and open mindedness, always seeing that she could learn something new and that she could really be taught by her clients.  That's something that I love about Social Work, is that, yes, we are training students to go out and help and empower others, but in the process, Social Workers are changed by the people that they meet along the way and by the stories that they hear. That's a really beautiful part of the profession, and something that I think our students begin to see as interns as well.

Curtis Isozaki  20:55

So well said! Professor Zuniga, how does our approach to practicum education bridge the gap between theory and practice in Social Work?

Melody York Zuniga  21:09

Yeah, I think that goes back to protecting that seminar course as really an opportunity for that to happen. Not only to process and connect and here, see here even more examples of how things look outside of your own internship experience. You know, in your classes, you're learning a set of skills. You're learning a process that's been proven to be effective, and you're learning about theories about the way humans work, the way groups of humans work, the way communities and organizations, different theories about why things happen the way they do, but until you get out into practice experiences, those are really just some ideas. So you come into the internship, [and] you actually work with clients, you actually work with organizational systems, and you see, okay, the theory says this, that helps me be ready to engage with the possibility of that showing up in this person or this place or this group of people, but I still have to think about what's unique to the client or the organization or the community in front of me.  The class really tries to help students do that. There's assignments throughout the class that ask students to engage in in taking some of the things they're learning in the classroom. And how have they seen that happen,or not, in their agency. So you know, weekly, students are reflecting in some way about making sense of what they've done, processing it. What do I do next? Where am I going with this client? But also, how does it connect to the things they're learning in the classroom. So I feel really pleased. I keep saying I'm proud of our program, but I really I am! We take such great care and put such energy into the way we do it, because we think it really sets students up for success, and that's one of the ways. Through those assignments, through those conversations, taking what we see in the textbook, what we learn on a PowerPoint, and how does it help prepare us and inform us, but also serve as a one data point as we then bring in unique client experiences, right? There's no theory or skill that if I take this, I can just rubber stamp it on every client that I see, right? But these are things that are proven to be effective, and now I have to think, you learn the phrase practice wisdom, but how do I weave what aspects of this are aren't going to apply or be effective with each person that I meet. So that's one of the ways I think we see that in the seminar, through the discussions and through the assignments that ask students to make those connections with what they're seeing in the real world.

Curtis Isozaki  23:58

So our community isn't just here in Waco, Texas, in downtown, in the downtown building, but we have students all over the nation experiencing just really these seminars in the online modality. So we often say that "We are ONE Garland School of Social Work, ONE MSW, TWO different modalities: both residential and online." The experiences are robust in their own ways. So, Professor Luce, if you could share a little bit about how The Garland School of Social Work supports online students in securing practicum placements, and how do these experiences and placement differ from the residential experience when it comes to being placed.

Whitney Luce  24:50

Yes, I can do that! For our online students, we have a practicum team that supports them as they are seeking placement. So that differs from our residential process, because there's just a couple of us at the Waco campus that are working with students, and there are agencies in this geographical area that we've used over and over again, because The Garland School has had and maintained those relationships with organizations. For online students, it is both challenging and exciting, because we are developing new partnerships in new places all the time, and the number of agencies that we are partnering with is is increasing all the time. We have passed 1000 contracts with agencies. So we do have to go through a contract process with agencies. We do work to vet an agency site, so that's making sure that they can meet the requirements of The Council on Social Work Education, our accrediting body and also also the requirements of The Garland School. So we have a team of placement specialists.  We also have someone dedicated to working on contracts with agencies. We have faculty members. So I work closely with two Associate Directors of Practicum Education who work only with our online students, and they are approving every internship site that students are going into. So our placement specialists are looking for agencies in the students particular geographic region and then and they are making contact, getting information about the site, as well as the specific supervisor there, because we do have requirements for supervisors as well as for site experiences. Also, those requirements are different per the level that the student is in, whether that's the first level of the MSW program or in the advanced practice internship. So there's different requirements we're looking at that, and a faculty member is approving, or not, sites to see if they are truly appropriate for students. So those are things going on on the agency side to vet and make sure that those agencies are appropriate for students.  Directly with the students, they [the student] are working with a placement specialist to talk about their interests, their long-term goals. We cannot guarantee that students are placed in the exact type of agency that they're hoping to work in in the future, but we do look at social justice issues of interest, populations of interest to students, and as much as possible. We try to place students in agencies that are within a broad area of interest for students, and we're helping students to look at "okay, what skills from this particular experience could I carry forward into these long term goals?" So the placement specialists are walking with students to have the beginning conversations of, okay, your placement is one semester away. Let's start talking together about what is of interest to you, what is in your community. If students have knowledge of sites that might be potential placements, we welcome that information from students, and then our team takes that, and then that's the site to make sure that they do meet our requirements.  So we do a combination of research of sites and then also taking leads, so to speak, from students, because we know that students are have their own connections, or know more about a particular area than we may and so we welcome that information, and then we really do a lot of work to vet those sites, while also keeping students apprised of those processes. Students also interview with agencies as part of the placement process, and so we work with students to talk about how to prepare for those interviews. We do some things to help them look at their resumes and start to get ready for those. Those are things that help them to secure an internship, but that also obviously helps them in their career long term. So those are some ways that we are walking alongside our students who are preparing for practicum, and then as students are in those placements, we've already talked to them about that liaison who works with them in their internship seminar. So throughout, throughout the experience we are maintaining that support of them, and then students, when they complete one internship, they're beginning to work with a placement specialist to secure that next internship as well.

Curtis Isozaki  30:14

As we start to wrap up with just a couple more questions, all this has been so so good. Thank you so much, Professor Luce and Professor Zuniga. As you're kind of reflecting on a lot of the different responses to these questions, you can just tell the robust attention to detail when it comes to practicum education and when you think about all the other MSW programs out there. Man, if there's a miss with that attention to detail [then] that is going to be such an additional burden on your overall education, and that this experience in The Garland School of Social Work and furthering your career, that it's nice to not have to worry about all these additional details that can impact your education, and that's why we have just an unbelievable practicum team and a team of professors and faculty and staff here to support you and your overall student success. Because our hope is that your success, that is yes, education, leads to engagement in your practice on the sites, and then really the experience that you're having in those spaces. Because education doesn't just take place in the classroom. What we love about The Garland School of Social Work [is] that it transcends the classroom into the different spaces in our local communities. So love that about what we do here in The Garland School of Social Work. And so as we wrap up with two more questions, wanted to ask Professor Zuniga, as we think about the practicum placement experience and process, what should students consider during the placement process, and how can they make the most out of this experience to shape their professional future?

Melody York Zuniga  32:03

Yeah, I think the biggest thing that comes to mind it's a phrase that Professor Luce already used, but keeping an open mind. I think [that] really is essential, not just in the placement process, but throughout the entire internship experience, and throughout the entire MSW experience and social work profession, but keeping an open mind. Then, also, kind of preparing for what it means to be a learner in that space. So I'll say a little bit more about what I mean by each of those. In keeping an open mind, you know, Professor Luce mentioned, you know that it may be that you were in a place that's exactly the kind of work you want to do in the future, and that's great! Or maybe you ended up in a place where you're like, "hey, this, I have this experience, but this isn't the kind of job I'll seek after. I'll seek a different kind of agency." That's also worthwhile experience, because no matter where you are, you are learning about how to show up, ready to hear from the client as the expert of their own experiences, and to sit next to them as a professional helper, but one who is not up here and they're down here, and you have all the answers, and they're lucky to be with you, right? Like no matter where you go, it takes practice, learning how to show up in that kind of way, where you are ready to listen, empathize and think with them about the tools within them and around them to move forward in whatever situation they're experiencing.  So that happens anywhere, that happens with any age group, that happens with any host setting of a school or a hospital or a clinic or a community center. Those things matter. The skills we use to communicate, to listen, to be sure when it's our turn to speak and to be quiet when it's not our turn to speak To answer the things we know, and to be honest when we don't know, and figure out what those kind of possibilities are for clients, that happens everywhere. And so the keeping an open mind about where you end up is really important, because you- your outlook on those things will set the stage for your experience, right? So I can say, Professor Luce, all I want to do in Social Work is work with kids. If I don't work with kids, I'll be just this is not even worth my time. Okay? It's great that I want to work with kids, but you know what kids have? Families, guardians and to be able to serve kids, if I have no skill or history in engaging with parents, grandparents, caretakers, teachers, the community resources, they'll go to I'm really not fully prepared to work with kids, right? So everything you do in your internship or even in your first job, if my dream is to work with kids down the road, great, but the job that was open was this community center doing this program. Okay! Go do that. Learn all about it and see what's how I can take these pieces and put them in my little, proverbial, professional purse or bag and take it with me to the dream job that I have. And also sometimes you'll surprise yourself with not knowing what that that place that clicks for you is.  So come ready to the placement process, right? So whether that's an interview with Professor Luce, or a phone call with a placement specialist, or whatever that looks like in your campus or your role. Come ready with ideas, right? That way you're not just like, " Meh, give me whatever," but if you would do, say, give me whatever, then great. Then, then be open to receive the piece that comes available because you really don't know what's waiting for you. As that learning opportunity, that "aha!" moment, that thing you didn't know you would like or dislike those kinds of things. So keep an open mind, right? No place is perfect, no person is perfect, including your supervisor, including you, including us. So keeping that open mind also then helps you be ready for kind of walking into the process as a learner. And being a learner means a couple of things, not just like, sit down, you're learning. There's some of that, right? Like, you're not coming in as the expert of how to do this, but you also are coming in with something, right? So come ready to learn, ready to receive feedback. It's hard to receive feedback. It's hard for somebody to tell you actually don't do it that way, but that's part of the process. That's part of being a student, that's part of learning and growing and getting shaped by someone. So receive that feedback as refinement, and like "all right! Now that I know to do that differently, I'm going to be even more skillful in my next interaction."  So that's part of it, learn, take feedback, realize you don't know it all already, and push through that fear, to initiate, to try to do something, even if you aren't sure it will go just right or is the exact right thing right? We have to hold those things in tension. I say imbalance, but they're never really imbalanced, so I try not to use that word as much, but we have to hold both of those things at the same time. We do not know everything, and we need feedback, and we have something to offer. I can sit in front of that client and not be afraid to speak, because part of what they need is a human that cares enough to sit down with them and listen to them and believe them, and help them figure out what their options are. You can come ready to do that right, and then we're going to add to that, skills, knowledge, resource awareness, nuanced ways to look out for certain kinds of things, but you come ready with a huge part of that, just by bringing your whole self and caring. So that's something I think I want people to realize early on, because it can shape how when we get afraid or kind of, "Can I do this?" You know, we can get real rigid about things, and so the more open-minded you can be about where the learning and the goodness is, and a readiness to kind of hold "I do have something to offer, but I I really need feedback and guidance," I think that'll set you up for success and for being more pleased with your experience along the way. So those are some ideas, but Professor Luce may have other things to add.

Whitney Luce  38:28

I really appreciate all that you offered, and I would say to students too, and what we often with practicum education are discussing with students, especially as they're beginning [the program], is that social work skills are sotransferable. So you could have an internship with older adults and gain skills that will also benefit you in working with teenagers. So many times, students come into the process and with the best of intentions; with passion and really a desire to serve in particular settings or with particular populations. Because of that, those good things that they bring, they're looking at it as "I can only be in this type of setting," but as Professor Zuniga mentioned, you will be surprised as you get into internship experiences about what really does resonate with you, or about the types of skills that you gain in an experience that you didn't seek out or that you didn't think would be your cup of tea, so to speak, or the place where you would find yourself and you will be able to learn and grow through that. So social work is not a profession where you have to have an internship in a particular area in order to then work in that area in the future. We see some other professions, maybe, I think about things like accounting, where students get an internship, and then that becomes a job, and if you don't get an internship in a particular firm, then it could be, you know, years before you could get into that. Social Work is different in that way, because it is such a broad, broad profession, that your skills in an internship are transferable across settings. So that really is something that is important, and is why we're wanting you to stay open minded and to consider all of the learning opportunities that could await you.

Curtis Isozaki  40:41

Thank you so much, Professor Luce and Professor Zuniga! I want to just take a moment to just wherever you may be, whether you're listening at home, getting ready for dinner or lunch, whatever that may look like, or maybe you're driving listening to just this webinar and reflecting on all the information when it comes to practical experience. We value in The Garland School of Social Work mindfulness, and so we just want to take, maybe just some time, just to take a moment to just pause reflect a little bit as we go into kind of a final question. To leave you with a response, a last thought from from Professor Luce and Professor Zuniga. I want to just take a moment to just just pause for a little bit reflect on some of the things that you've heard. So Professor Luce, Professor Zuniga, would you be willing to share kind of a final word to our friends who are joining us today, future students in The Garland School of Social Work, [that are] excited about practicum experience, eager to talk to talk about placement and where they can be in what population, and there's some takeaways with that today. But would you be able to just leave us with a final word? And if we had a question to kind of frame that final word, or maybe there's something that you'd like to share to just wrap up, but kind of a question would be, how does practicumeducation and experiences prepare students for leadership and service as a social worker?

Whitney Luce  42:41

So when I think about preparation for leadership and service, a few things come to mind with internship. One is the various supervision opportunities that students have. So part of what we really want for students is to learn how to use supervision well. So for anyone to become a better practitioner, to serve clients well, to grow in their leadership skills, they have to be able to utilize supervision. So for instance, helping students learn how to come to weekly supervision, prepared to say, "Okay, what have I done this week that has been challenging? Where do I have questions? What do I see as a win? How can I bring that into supervision and see what my supervisor might add to that? How do I look at the wisdom and experience of those who have done this longer than I have, and how can I glean from that knowledge and really begin to build my own practice wisdom as I move forward?" And also something that in practicum education, we've tried to prepare our students for is having hard conversations. That is part of leadership and service, is how do we say, for instance, okay, I saw this happen within the agency. Or perhaps there's a policy and I'm a little bit concerned about it, or I don't understand why that's in place. Could you please help me understand more about that? Then perhaps through that conversation, also, students are saying, "you know, I've read this article through part of my my coursework, and I wonder what that would bring to this conversation about this particular policy. How could we discuss that together?"  So really, students get the opportunity to talk with their practicum liaison who is teaching the course with their supervisor at their agency. They may have one or two supervisors that they're meeting with on a regular basis, and they're getting to learn what those collegial relationships are like and what those hard conversations may be. Where they're saying "Huh? I'm seeing something that I am concerned about or that I think could be different or expanded or change. How do I navigate that and really getting to kind of try out some different approaches in their learning experience that will then set them up in the future?" For leadership, leaders have to be able to have difficult conversations and be able to work well with others.  Another thing that really helps prepare students is that many of our students are working in interdisciplinary teams when they're an internship. So whether that be in a healthcare setting or a school setting, for instance, they're working with people from all different disciplines and learning how to bring their own skills and knowledge as a social worker and begin to feel confident in being able to speak up in those interdisciplinary spaces, but also seeing the strengths that other disciplines bring and how they can work well together. So those are skills that they begin to gain that really serve them well as practitioners in the future. So, Professor Zuniga, I invite you to jump in as well, but those are some things that really stand out for me.

Melody York Zuniga  46:32

Absolutely! I think you've made some super important points, and I other things I think about when it what it means to be leaders, to really know what it looks like on the ground, so to speak, you know. So you have hopes of running a nonprofit someday, or advocating for changes that need to happen related to certain kinds of systems or policies that are unjust or damaging or missing and needed. When you can speak to these actual clients you visited with, actual experiences you've seen on the ground, your internships expose you to the reality of what people are facing every day.Not only clients and their real stories and real experiences and real needs, but also agencies and the people that are trying, that are trying to help make a difference. Professor Luce mentioned you might be like, "Hey, I read this. Could this be done here? I'm concerned about this." So all of those inform the next level of your career, because you've seen what it really looks like when people are on the ground, on the front line, so to speak, of this profession. What do they need? What are their joys? What are their struggles? What are they missing? Where are they thriving, and how can leaders know that and come alongside that in a way that's informed? Not just sticking to Well, the book says this, or the theory says this, right? But okay, here's what the the research says, the theories say, how does that actually look when we try to apply it to real life? And the more people will see that you have experience there, and even if it's not tons of experience, it's enough to inform your care and belief and advocacy for folks that you would lead down the road. So I think that's important, what it exposes you to, what it gives you a chance to actually do the work before you're leading people doing the work. I think that's really important for leaders.  And again, just the connections you'll make in the internship, I think just- they matter, right? So as you enter into challenges, joys, those kinds of things, make those connections. Think about your behavior, your approach to conflict, your approach to problem solving, because people will remember you. How do you want to be remembered when you messed up? Did you freeze and quit? Did you say, Okay, I hear that and I'm ready to try again when you disagreed, how did you show up in a way that heard the other person and offered what you had to say at the same time, those things matter. Those things will show what people will get from you when things get hard, or when they would consider you for a position at their agency. Right? So, like Professor Luce mentioned, some of our students are getting hired at those agencies. Sometimes they're getting hired at agencies that their, their supervisor knows these people and said, "Hey, I worked with this person in their internship," or they were at a coalition meeting together, and remembered you being kind, being sure of yourself, being able to advocate in a way that shows your value of organizations, your value of clients, those things matter. so Not as pressure, but just as reminders that like you, these are connections that you'll use down the road, and that can really give you the chance to show your leadership potential, even when you are more novice when it comes to entering the profession. And again, just you know, you walk out of the MSW program with, you know, two settings of experience in doing social work. You do walk out with experience on your resume. You aren't as green as another profession where you've learned all about it, and now you hope someone will let you do it. You've done it already, and I think that is what's wonderful about the social work education period, no matter where you are. Then with Baylor's program, how much we've really like we've said before, gotten into the details to make that as rich an experience as possible for you.

Curtis Isozaki  50:59

Well, thank you so much, Professor Luce, Professor Zuniga, for such a rich conversation! I feel like so many of us have a better understanding of practicum education, and I hope that all of you have been able to really capture our heart and our vision in The Garland School of Social Work, which is valuing humanity, engaging spirituality and promoting equity. I hope that you're able to take some time to reflect, remember and really just re-energize just your excitement for being a social worker [who is] prepared for worldwide service and leadership. Thank you so so much for joining us! Looking forward to meeting you in person, online and really our next conversation. Have a great rest of your day! Looking forward to chatting with you soon you!